Episode 8: What Now for Virginia's Budget and Minimum Wage Hike?
The General Assembly has arrived back in Richmond for a highly unusual special session.
The task at hand: figure out Virginia’s state budget during this pandemic related economic seizure. Also: sort out the bills that Governor Ralph Northam sent back for revisions.
What now for Virginia's budget and minimum wage hikes?
Read the Transcript:
Nathan Moore: This is Bold Dominion, an explainer for state politics in a changing Virginia. I'm Nathan Moore.
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NM: I'm taping this on April 22 and the General Assembly has just arrived back in Richmond. The House of Delegates is meeting under a big tent on the Capitol grounds. The Senate in a huge room at the Science Museum. The task at hand: figure out Virginia state budget during this pandemic-related economic seizure. Also sought out those bills that Governor Ralph Northam sent back for revisions.
Sally Hudson: There are some people who believe that during an economic downturn, now is not the time to raise wages or empower workers. I am not one of those people. Raising the minimum wage like we had planned on January 1 is exactly what we need to do to start to inject some more money back into those pockets and readjust as an economy to make sure that everyone has the--you know, the support that they need to carry on.
NM: That's Democratic state lawmaker Sally Hudson, who represents the Charlottesville area in the Virginia House of Delegates. We're going to hear a lot more from her in the second half of today's show. Here on Bold Dominion, we've talked about the big changes in Virginia politics this year. Having a Democratic governor and Democratic majorities in both houses of the assembly--that's the first time that's happened in a very long time. As such, the General Assembly passed a whole raft of legislation this year in the session that just wrapped up earlier this spring. Peter Galuszka is a journalist based in the Richmond area, who's covered Virginia business, politics and news for four decades. I talked with him about all the bills going into effect, and some of the ones that are still sitting on the table.
Peter Galuszka: There are a lot of breakthrough items that have passed and have been signed, and a couple that unfortunately have been delayed. And we'll go over those in a little bit. But the ones that really--there's so many of them, for example, that passed and signed into law include: ratifying the Equal Rights Amendment, which could help that nationally. You don't have to wait 24 hours for an abortion. No longer can you discriminate due to sexual identity or gender, marijuana has been decriminalized to some extent. Gun laws, for example, have been really--you know, which always have been a sticking item in the Republican-controlled General Assembly went forward to some extent. There are red flag laws that say if someone appears to be a danger, they can go to the police and they'll be temporarily stripped of their firearm. So they won't hurt themselves or someone else. You have to, you know, report a gun loss, if you lose a gun, you've got to report it within 24 hours so they can get a handle on it. And these were really seriously opposed by, you know, more rural legislators and by lobbying by the National Rifle Association, which as you know, is is headquartered in Virginia. So those are some of the laws that really kind of would never have seen the light of day in previous assemblies. So they have.
NM: It is definitely a strong turn toward the liberal side--or at least the center, compared to years past. There are, though, some bills that Northam is asking for changes to; asking to amend some bills and send them back for this or that. The two that I noticed in particular were increases to the state's minimum wage and also collective bargaining rights for municipal workers if a municipality opt in. What's the logic behind these delays or asking for amendments on these?
PG: Well, there is some logic and some just political muscle. What happened was that, you know, the more conservative elements in the legislature have certainly fought raising the minimum wage and they failed to do so in the regular session of the General Assembly. So by banding together into coalitions and other groups, they have really lobbied hard, claiming that the COVID-19 pandemic is going to make it impossible to give everybody a raise especially since corporations and city governments etc, have are seen budgets slashed because they're not getting the tax revenue. A few just a few months ago, Virginia was doing very well budget-wise. So now it's going to take a hit. So what happened basically was this on the minimum wage, it was supposed to take starting on June--this June. So you know, it was supposed to go from $7.25, in gradations, to eventually $12 an hour. And they're both due to really go into effect in January, now they're being pushed back to May 2021. That also includes collective bargaining rights for certain city and county workers. Lee Carter, a legislator, was really upset about this. So have union people like in the AFL-CIO. They're saying this is unfair, because a lot of the people who aren't minimum wage tend to be minorities or women. And they're doing--essentially, some of them are doing essential work, such as being grocery store clerks and others who really are needed right now. And, and yet they're being the lowest paid and there are many ways some of the most at risk from the virus. So it's a bit kind of disconcerting. And Northam has taken some hits for backing down on this. The big issue is whether these will eventually go through or if the conservatives have really put a wedge in the issue, so they can, you know, seriously take it apart over time.
NM: And, you know, there is now that chance that it could happen--that there could be changes to the minimum wage increase bill or the collective bargaining bill or several of these others before they actually were to go into effect now.
PG: That's right. I mean, you've gotten one delay. And, you know, it's the same old tactic. I mean, both parties use it, legislation is going somewhere at the last minute you tack on something that makes it go in the other direction. It's kind of curious that you have this pandemic that's very painful. And now it's being used as an excuse to deny people you know, collective bargaining rights and the right to a decent living.
NM: It is decidedly a move to the center or move to the liberal tilt on all these bills that have gone through and many of which Northam has now signed. There is still though, you know, I'm struck by a pattern where you've got changes in gun laws, LGBT anti discrimination, voting access monuments, but those kind of bread and butter worker issues, Virginia's establishment is still really uncomfortable changing the status quo.
PG: You're right, because the Virginia Municipal League, which is I think there's 30 plus 30, you know, cities and counties in it, they lobbied hard to get rid of some of the labor issues. They don't want it. And then they said, we can't pay these people extra money. We can't allow them to have unions, and the business community likewise. And so you know, those elements in Virginia have not left. I mean, you have a whole hierarchy of pro-business, people who love to proclaim that you know, say Forbes or someone has declared Virginia the number one state for business they really like that and, and Oxfam, for example, a British outfit has rated Virginia is very low in workers rights. And this has just been the case forever in the state, and it goes back to the plantation mentality of its ancestral elite. It kind of goes back to the anti-union movements for textile workers more than 100 years ago. And the whole idea that there's, you know, sort of castes and blue collar workers are in a lower caste, and that's just too bad. And this is kind of mentality that you don't see in other parts of the country.
NM: That Oxfam rating didn't just show Virginia as being not great for worker rights. We were actually ranked 51 out of 51. Because we were last.
PG: *Laughter* Yeah, well, it was really pretty bad. You know, at the same time, you have all these these other ratings agency saying for business and, you know, corporate elite, it's great. As far as taxation as far as you know, giving them the upper hand. That's changing though, and it's the state turns bluer with more people from different backgrounds moving in, that eventually will change.
NM: The question on this really is, I mean, there is a point at which we reopen the economy, sort of scale back on social distancing, but the World Health Organization has issued recommendations on what needs to be in place for that to happen. What, I mean, how close is Virginia to that?
PG: Well, I think a key key factor to that is getting a quick, efficient, accurate test for COVID-19. It's been all over the place, you know, the health care sector and the state have been totally unprepared for this. The federal government being led by Donald Trump is chaos, a chaotic mess. So nobody knows what's coming on. If you can get a number--and there are some products, mostly some progress, like with Abbott Labs is coming in with a testing thing. There might be a regime for a vaccine at some point in the next 12 months. Together that would really, you know, turn the tide. But once again, you know, you have Trump saying at one point that he's in total control and the governor say that's ridiculous, and then Trump backs down. So you know, it's just like a big kabuki theater and it's kind of nuts and it's not the time to do this.
NM: You've seen in Virginia as well as lots of other places, states around the country now where what bipartisan consensus there may have once been in terms of fighting this disease and all staying home and keeping it from spreading and killing hundreds of thousands of Americans. That's sort of evaporating somewhat, at least on the far right. You've got people showing up and protesting a capital saying "Reopen the economy! I don't care if my grandma dies!" I mean, really.
PG: And well, I think one of the ones one of the maverick, formerly GOP people is Senator Amanda Chase from you know, my home county of Chesterfield and--
NM: Voice of reason here in Virginia.
PG: *Laughter.* Well, anyway, she was putting out stuff on Facebook and other places saying that, you know, Northam was making a statement about the next step as far as reopening certain businesses. And she was claiming falsely with no foundation that Northam was going to announce that everything would be shut down through August--or into August. Turned out not to be true. All that poor Northam did was delay the openings by a couple weeks from late April to, I think it's May 8 now, and that may be changed. But there's--I know a lot of the conservative blogs, there's been a real outcry. But Virginia is not as bad as some states like Rhode Island or Texas, where state police and National Guard are checking out of state cars coming in and turning them away. I think that is really cause for concern. That's really nuts. But you know, I mean, what do you do? If you've got a chemical plant fire and explosion, it's perfectly appropriate for the law enforcement to coordinate off--to keep the public out for their safety. And that's sort of what's going on here. I mean, you know, and I don't think Virginia has really taken as tough steps as other states have, as far as you know, enforcing social distancing, wearing masks and the like. So I don't know I--there's not, you know, you some people have even raised the specter of a fascist takeover by the likes of Northam, which is kind of insane.
NM: Yeah, I mean, certainly, there's been a long standing fear among--sort of undercurrent of American life in a way of fear of state power. At the same time, you know, organized state power is sort of how you have to respond to a pandemic.
PG: Well, the other kind of interesting thing--what you're saying is absolutely right. But I mean, the other thing that's happening, which is really weird, is sort of the role reversals in federalism and the concepts of federalism. For a long time, one side of the fence was saying: "Oh, states rights, you know, states should have rights." And this is the same argument, of course, to go against integrating schools back in the 1950s. That states had rights. And, and usually the more liberal people want the federal government to come in, as it did during Civil Rights, for example, to enforce desegregation rules. And now it's sort of the opposite way; you have somebody like Trump saying he's all in power, but at the same time that people were really taking the lead in the crisis are governors. You know, such as Andrew Cuomo and Gavin Newsom out in California. And even Virginia has sort of joined up with its neighbors like Maryland and DC and North Carolina, to try to present a more coordinated approach regionally, sort of a Mid-Atlantic pact or something like that, to sort of make sure that everybody's on board as far as recording data, and, you know, reopening economies when, you know, it's possible. So you're seeing this sort of reverse now you're seeing the liberals and the moderates going towards the Federalist side, right, having the states do it.
NM: And that's partly, I feel like, out of a real dearth of leadership from the federal side of things, I mean, the the response has been inconsistent and pretty bad when it comes to both communication and supplying sort of needed goods and, and funds to people who need it. Now the CARES Act has been a big, you know, one time boom, but we'll see how that goes long term. But I think in the meantime, all the governor's you're talking about are trying to like kludge together a version of a federal response in the absence of an actual federal response.
PG: That's true. It's also true as some people say that, you know, regulating healthcare is really a state responsibility in many ways. I mean, the feds do it for drugs and things like that. But when it comes to nursing homes and other acute care facilities, it's really the state's job to do that. And there are serious questions about whether the Virginia Department of Health has fallen down on the job. And you know, the case in suburban Richmond involving Canterbury Rehabilitation Centers is up. And that's one of the worst death rates in the country. And it hasn't happened before. What happened there? We don't know.
NM: Well, let's bring it back home to Virginia politics and what kind of--what comes next year. We've been flattening the curve and it seems to be working. It has made the economy take a real hit. We've seen some legislation signed by Northam--quite a bit that--does move the state towards kind of a...I don't know centrist or maybe even slightly liberal place. But it's gonna have some real hits to the budget. I mean, you know, sales tax, income tax, corporate tax, they're all gonna be way down this year because of the Coronavirus' economic impact. What comes next?
PG: Well, I think the General Assembly's gonna meet briefly shortly, and that--we'll see what happens there about whether they're gonna fund the Regional Gas House Initiative or not, is a big question, because that's supposed to take place as of July 1. I'm all in favor of it. I think it's a great idea. Because, you know, climate change has not gone away. So I don't know. I mean, it's a big question we've--still up in the air are elections for municipalities. What's going to happen with the national conventions, that's not known. And, you know, I'm hoping there's still, you know, an election in November. I mean, a big fear is that Trump might just do something very constitutionally in question and somehow shut down elections and I don't know what's gonna happen.
NM: Right. A lot of open questions. That's why we talk every week.
PG: I know I know. Just trying to keep the listener riveted.
NM: Alright, well Peter, thanks so much for taking the time today.
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NM: Peter Galuszka is a journalist based in the Richmond area. He's been covering Virginia business, politics, and news for four decades.
You're listening to Bold Dominion, a state politics explainer for a changing Virginia. Visit us online at BoldDominion.org. Have a friend who's trying to figure out Virginia state politics? Tell them about the show, and then subscribe. We're on Spotify, Apple Podcasts and wherever find podcasts are served up. Bold Dominion is a member of the Virginia Audio Collective. Online at VirginiaAudio.org. Whether you're into Virginia history, or jazz, or Charlottesville's local news, we've got something to tickle your fancy. We also welcome our newest podcast member, Charlottesville Quarantine Report. It's looking at how one town and the state overall are responding to this COVID-19 crisis. Check out all those podcasts at VirginiaAudio.org.
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Well with Democratic majorities in the General Assembly plus a Democratic governor in Richmond, you might think that all the bills that passed the spring would sail right through into law. But then came the novel Coronavirus and the economic seizure in Virginia and around the country. Governor Ralph Northam has not signed a few of these bills. He's asked the General Assembly to delay raising the minimum wage, and also to delay letting some municipal workers form unions and collectively bargain. Sally Hudson is a labor economist. She represents the 57th district in the Virginia General Assembly.
SH: There are some people who believe that during an economic downturn now is not the time to raise wages or empower workers. I am not one of those people. I think actually now is a great time for us to be taking those steps forward as a Commonwealth. I think a lot of people are realizing in particular, that they've been taking a lot of workers for granted for quite some time and especially a lot of folks who have been making substandard wages are the ones who need most to provide essential services to us every day. And I think raising the minimum wage like we had planned on January 1 is exactly what we need to do to start to inject some more money back into those pockets and readjust as an economy to make sure that everyone has, you know, the support that they need to carry on. In particular, I find the delay in the collective bargaining for local workers to be especially frustrating, because I don't think there's a time that public sector workers more deserve a seat at the table and during a recession. I think workers always deserve a seat at the table, but especially in times when resources are tight, local governments are going to have to make cuts. These things are going to be hard and lots of different ways, and workers deserve a seat at that table to understand whether it's going to happen with staffing shortages or salary freezes or with adjustments to you know, essential equipment, all those things. So count me among the folks who adamantly opposes the rationale for those moves.
What we do about them is politically tricky, because you know, the House, in particular the progressive wing of the House is much more progressive than the governor. And if we don't accept those amendments, then the governor's next move can be to veto. And ultimately, that's a political call about whether you want to play chicken with the executive. Because that's a real risk. If we don't agree to delay these provisions by five months, then the governor could decide to veto them outright. And that's a tough call to make and honestly one that I'm still weighing, Because I don't want to see that work be unraveled. And so there might be a case for accepting them and ensuring that we get something without leaving workers with nothing, especially with the understanding that if the governor does veto, and we go back next session, it's not clear that in a different economy that we get as far as we did, this time around, you know, the biggest barrier to progress on labor in Virginia is the Senate and the Senate is not going to change next year. We go back and deal with the same senators who may, during an economic downturn, be even more conservative than they were this year. And so the calculus here for me is not about political ideology. It's entirely about political probability. You know, how do you think other people are going to play? And what does that mean for the landscape?
NM: So on one hand, you weigh the possibility, the danger that Northam could just veto the the increases outright. On the other hand, if you all accept the delay, then the next General Assembly session, some new bills could go in place that could mess it all up with a new timing. How do you weigh that?
SH: That's a good question. You know, I'm still actively engaged in that and trying to think about. I'm someone who would be looking to follow the lead of labor. I mean, I think ultimately, we can all make those calls personally, but I want to do them in close collaboration with labor leaders, with SEIU and AFL-CIO. I don't want to take risks with their workers that they don't want me to. In a tricky situation. I think it's important to make sure that you have the buy in from the people most directly affected by your decisions. And so those are conversations we're all still having and I will be looking, ultimately, to share solidarity with them. And I'll stick my neck out as far as they want us to.
NM: There have been a lot of stories in the last week or so in the media about, you know, new gun restrictions, gun safety measures, Virginia now passing and Northam signing an LGBT anti discrimination bill, new rules around voter access and making Election Day a holiday and other bills as well. And this narrative of Virginia moving in this really progressive direction, but on kind of bread and butter workers rights issues, it's not--there's sort of a fear of changing the status quo. How would you characterize the situation in Virginia?
SH: Yeah, you know, I think, the nail on the head, you know, I think right now, among the political crowd, it's way cooler to be socially progressive than economically progressive. And it's easier for folks to put forth a lot of those--what for some political people are symbolic gains, ahead of the ones that really remake our economic structure. And I don't say that in any way to belittle how critical that progress is. I mean, the laws that you just described will make an enormous difference in the lives of specific people; when it comes to gun safety, when it comes to protections in public accommodations for our LGBTQ neighbors, and especially when it comes to the right to vote, those are all things that matter enormously in the lives of real people, but they don't fundamentally alter the power structure that we live in. So I think that's why you find it easier for folks to let those pieces move first.
NM: My own analysis of looking at parties, both nationally and also in Virginia these days is you've got a very far right GOP that's kind of moved even further to the right over the last couple decades, got kind of a center right party called the Democrats and kind of a center-left party also called the Democrats. How are you navigating all this?
SH: Yeah, I mean, at a time when the traditional Republican Party in Virginia, I think, is really hollowed out and lacking in leadership, we on the Democratic side, encounter a problem which is at some point our tent gets too big to be tenable. Too many people are living under the banner of "we're Democrats." And fundamentally, I think if you don't recognize that real social justice and equity requires as a precondition major economic reform, then at some point, I don't think you can live in the same tent. Like we can't have a party that believes in social progressivism, and stays under that banner with two fundamentally different beliefs about how the economy should work. I don't think that's tenable for the long term. I think that's what has to occur at some point. And right now, we're just in an awkward place where the Republican Party isn't holding up its end of the sparring match and absorbing that intellectual link. And so what do we do about that? It's a big reason why I'm an active proponent for election reform itself. I think we have got to create systems through stronger redistricting policies, through things like rank choice voting, that will reinvigorate a competent conservative wing as well to absorb some of what is currently flying under the democratic moniker--so that the Democratic party can embrace its real progressive identity. I don't--I don't think we can all live under this tent for too long.
NM: So common cause for a while while Trump is in office, and then we'll see what happens after.
SH: Yeah, you're right. He's sort of a uniquely and singularly polarizing figure and dangerous person. And I don't think it's misplaced that a lot of folks are focusing heavily on changing things at the top. But there's a lot of other good folks who are thinking hard about how we redo structures that support and provoke this rise.
NM: I know you've got a meeting in a few minutes, but I want to ask: there's a looming question right now, with the coronavirus spreading throughout Virginia and social distancing severely reducing economic activity in the state right now. The state budget is going to take a serious hit, what comes next?
SH: It's a great question. I think the most important thing that we can do in terms of doing right by our budget and the people who call Virginia home is to make sure that all options are on the table. I think there can be a temptation in a time like this, to bring a sort of old spending/new spending framework to the problem and say, "well, we can't do anything new, we have to come back to what's old. and then we start, you know, cutting closer to the bone from there." I don't think that's the right mindset, because so much of the old budget was shaped under a Republican General Assembly. And so if we default to "old is austere" or "old as baseline," then we're starting from the wrong baseline. I think that we have to be willing to take a whole look at the pie from a bird's eye view, and think about: under democratic leadership in the General Assembly and in the governor's mansion, what do the core services look like through our lens and then build up from there and that may mean a reshuffling of things and spending priorities toward more economic and human driven services and you know, less away from other priorities of the past.
NM: What are some examples of previous old spending baselines that you would want to re-examine.
SH: I don't understand how you don't put health at the core of what we do going forward. Everyone is on the front lines of our health care system, whether it's our emergency medical services, or the Virginia Department of Health, or, you know, our Medicaid patients, you know, just recognizing, especially in a time of a pandemic, it becomes painfully clear to people who were previously unaware that we're all in it together when it comes to our health, because they can actually physically see infection spread from one to another. But it's always been that way. Health has always been systemic. And so I don't know how we don't have a budget that centers healthcare and healthcare workers, because we don't get out of our economic challenges until we get physically healthier. And so I think that, you know, we've got to start putting that at the top as opposed to an afterthought, whereas this, the proposals that are currently being floated about how we attack our budget problem is to roll back the investments that we made in healthcare this time around, which I think is precisely backward.
NM: How are you working to influence that conversation right now?
SH: It's a challenge because the General Assembly is not physically in session. And you know, as we've talked about, from the very first time we ever got together, Virginia has a very weak legislature by design. You know, we're not in session right now. And so it's, it's really back to the kind of personal networking of trying to make your case through a combination of direct relationships and also where you can to leverage the media and folks like you to make some noise about things that matter. So doing our best, but now is a time where I'm keenly aware just how hamstrung we are in Virginia by our part-time General Assembly.
There are all sorts of things that constituents are asking us to do that make all sorts of sense that we can't, because we're not in session. And that means that unless the governor already sent it down as an amendment for reconvene, we can't do it. Unless we were to come back in a special session and pass it with an emergency clause. And an emergency clause requires a four fifths vote. So you'd have to get 80% of the General Assembly. That means a whole bunch of Republicans to get on board. So all of the wonderful, energetic, imaginative constituents who I have flooding my inbox with good ideas, I have to come back them often and say, "Do you think you can get 30 Republicans to vote for this? Because if the answer is no, it can't happen until at least January." And that means it can't be voted on until at least January, which means it can't take effect until July 2021. So when we say it's a problem that we have a part-time legislature, one of the biggest parts of that problem is it leaves us very ill-equipped to cope with problems that are moving fast and we rely entirely on a centralized executive for that agility.
NM: Well, there's a quick session coming up, possibly outdoors with masks over on the State Capitol grounds. Take me through what that's gonna look like for you.
SH: It's a great question, you know, about as much as I do at that point, those details are still coming together. But I know a lot of people are thinking hard about how to keep us safe, but I do know we'll be outside. I do know that they're working hard to make sure that we're protected and keeping us spaced apart while at the same time trying to maintain the standards of public transparency in terms of footage, and you know, all of that live streaming. So that stuff is coming together. Fortunately, the people who are planning that are much closer to Richmond than I am. So we're in good hands..
NM: Alright. Sally, thanks for taking the time.
SH: Absolutely. Always great to talk to you, Nathan.
NM: Yep, we'll do it again sometime soon.
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NM: Sally Hudson is a Democrat representing the 57th district in the Virginia General Assembly. Thanks to her and also to journalist Peter Galuszka. They both spoke to us this week via Skype. My name is Nathan Moore, and I'm the host of Bold Dominion. Huge thanks to our producers this week, Aaryan Balu and Sabrina Moore. Find this show online at BoldDominion.org. Go ahead and subscribe; it's just a click away. Y'all keep on social distancing, and I'll talk with you again in two weeks.